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Re: Gleanings from the "Gospels" [message #10727 is a reply to message #10726] Sun, 12 January 2014 10:33 Go to previous messageGo to previous message
Gary  is currently offline Gary
Messages: 1025
Registered: August 2008
Location: Indiana
Senior Member
Hi William and James,

Thanks for sharing here.

William I was thinking about what James said, and ran across some other passages that make this distinction of peoples character. Simeon in the temple was said to be a "just" man.

Quote:

Luke 2:25 And behold, there was a man in Jerusalem whose name was Simeon, and this man was just and devout, waiting for the Consolation of Israel, and the Holy Spirit was upon him.


Zacharias and Elizabeth were both said to be righteous:

Quote:

Luke 1:6 And they were both righteous before God, walking in all the commandments and ordinances of the Lord blameless.


This morning I was reminded of Jesus when He approached Nathanael He told him he was a man with no deceit, or guile if you read the KJV.

Quote:

John 1: Jesus saw Nathanael coming toward Him, and said of him, “Behold, an Israelite indeed, in whom is no deceit!”


It just seemed interesting that concerning all these people, the Spirit of God makes a point in the Word to show these characteristics about them. They were just, righteous, no guile, etc.

James after reading your post I was wondering about this as well. I went back and looked at all the passages and came across what looked like a contradiction.

Years ago a man set a Bible in front of me and said; "I can show you were that "Book" is full of contradictions." I personally don't believe there are any contradictions and everything is given by the Spirit of God. I don't think people realize that with God there is no "time" factor and that "time" was created for us. And as we all know you have to have ears to hear and eyes to see. It's Spiritual in nature and we are born of the Spirit.

I will try to make an attempt here to explain. The three wise men are only found in Matthews gospel. We know they came from the East and from another country.

Quote:

Matthew 2:12 Then, being divinely warned in a dream that they should not return to Herod, they departed for their own country another way.


Here's what I believe took place James concerning what you shared and it hopefully will be clear at the end of this post.

Mary and Joseph lived in Nazareth.

Quote:

Luke 1:26-27 Now in the sixth month the angel Gabriel was sent by God to a city of Galilee named Nazareth, 27 to a virgin betrothed to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David. The virgin’s name was Mary.


Caesar Augustus said; the whole world needed to be registered. Joseph was of the lineage of David so he traveled back to his home town to register him and his new wife in this new governmental census.

There must of been thousands of people on foot traveling at this time who participated in this census. Bethlehem is five miles south of Jerusalem, while Nazareth is several hundred miles north.

This is all pertinent so bear with me.

When they get to Bethlehem Mary who is with child delivers her baby, there is no room at the inn and then we have this passage:

Quote:

Luke 2:7 And she brought forth her firstborn Son, and wrapped Him in swaddling cloths, and laid Him in a manger, because there was no room for them in the inn.


Next we see the shepherds being visited by a whole Angelic host, praising God for what has taken place.

I believe the three wise men possibly could be entering Jerusalem at this same time. At this point I am assuming Joseph could of had relatives and they moved temporarily to a house. The wise men came to see Jesus at a "house" we know for sure, which possibly could of been relatives of Joseph. But we don't have all the information here so I would assume this, because you did mention renting or buying a place to stay in. It seems logical that he had relatives there.

The point is, I think it almost had to be close to the time Jesus was circumcised, eight days after He was born, Mary had to stay somewhere so when she went to the temple to be purified by her sacrifices. There is a number of events that take place at the same time. The known facts are intertwined in both books, Matthew and Luke.

The wise men show up and are warned in a dream, they leave by another route, Herod is angry and goes and murders thousands of children in Bethlehem and the surrounding districts, while Joseph who is warned in a dream, flees to Egypt. I believe they were only in Egypt a very short time and that Herod died within a month of killing all these children.

The problem I ran across in this event was that Luke says when the child was circumcised eight days later that Mary fulfilled her purification that they returned to their own city in Nazareth.

Quote:

Luke 2:21 And when eight days were completed for the circumcision of the Child, His name was called Jesus, the name given by the angel before He was conceived in the womb.

22 Now when the days of her purification according to the law of Moses were completed, they brought Him to Jerusalem to present Him to the Lord


In the temple Simeon prophesies and then it says:

Quote:

Luke 2:39 So when they had performed all things according to the law of the Lord, they returned to Galilee, to their own city, Nazareth.


Between verse 21 and verse 22 is when Herod died and they returned. I looked up the passage in Leviticus about the circumcising of a boy and the purification time of a woman.

[quote] Leviticus 12:1 Then the Lord spoke to Moses, saying, 2 “Speak to the children of Israel, saying: ‘If a woman has conceived, and borne a male child, then she shall be unclean seven days; as in the days of her customary impurity she shall be unclean. 3 And on the eighth day the flesh of his foreskin shall be circumcised.
4 She shall then continue in the blood of her purification thirty-three days. She shall not touch any hallowed thing, nor come into the sanctuary until the days of her purification are fulfilled.

Mary could not go into the Temple until this time period had ended, they very well could of learned at this time that Archelaus was ruling over Judea by what this passage in Matthew states:

Quote:

Matthew 2:19 Now when Herod was dead, behold, an angel of the Lord appeared in a dream to Joseph in Egypt, 20 saying, “Arise, take the young Child and His mother, and go to the land of Israel, for those who sought the young Child’s life are dead.” 21 Then he arose, took the young Child and His mother, and came into the land of Israel.


I believe this is another gap that he learned this information below after they returned to the Temple for Mary's time of purification.

Quote:

22 But when he heard that Archelaus was reigning over Judea instead of his father Herod, he was afraid to go there. And being warned by God in a dream, he turned aside into the region of Galilee. 23 And he came and dwelt in a city called Nazareth, that it might be fulfilled which was spoken by the prophets, “He shall be called a Nazarene.”


Please read both accounts together and you'll see why it seems to be an apparent contradiction, and why I came to this conclusion here. Herod had to have died shortly after his killing spree and Joseph and Mary would of returned to the temple for her to be able to offer the sacrifices to fulfill the law for a woman's purification. I agree with what you shared Matthew used the term "young child" but he was speaking of Jesus as a baby.

I sure hoped this answered your question and I was able to make it plain enough to understand.

Gary









[Updated on: Sun, 12 January 2014 15:08]

 
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