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| Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1174] |
Fri, 08 February 2008 01:46  |
 a barn kid
Messages: 14
Registered: November 2006 |
Junior Member |
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I don't recall a particular message, but it seems to me that growing up I had the impression that involvement in politics or voting was a bad thing....and that people at FA didn't vote....we were to pray.
More than 20 years has passed now - and while obviously we are to pray - I don't really know why we shouldn't vote.
I mean, the catch would seem to be that we wouldnt' want to vote contrary to God's will.
Still, the obvious answer to that is that if we can't know God's will about who is supposed to be President, why would that be? Why wouldnt' James 1 "if any man ask wisdom of God who gives liberally yada yada" apply here as well.
It seems that God would rather (and any sane person) want anyone but a liberal prochoicer in office picking out the next Supreme Court justices..........of course that's just mere "man's logic" - and perhaps God would feel otherwise inclined -
1. I guess here's the twist. Do you believe that you can know God's will?
2. If so, does just common sense approach such as watching the primaries, researching a candidate's record, watching speeches, etc. mean that you arent' "in faith"?
3. Would going to then vote for this person who meets "christian" criteria be not "in faith"?
4. Anyone recall the exact argument for not voting, but just praying?
5. Why would voting really be bad. I mean how is it logical that christians not vote if we want a moral society, with God centered judges appointed and our leader seeking GOD for direction instead of someone else?
- signed,
flaming fiscal and social conservative
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1183 is a reply to message #1180] |
Sat, 09 February 2008 12:14  |
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mark1124
Messages: 48
Registered: February 2006
Location: Salem, Mass. |
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If I may share my $.02 here it is this:
First, the scripture says that God places leaders into office whom He wills. I also remember when Brother Freeman said that we are not of this world (as the scriptures teach) and that we are of another kingdom. But here is another take to keep in mind folks: Ask yourself this question: What did the first century church and the early Christians do? Did they vote or not? If you go back into church history, you will find that Christians did not get involved in politics at all. That means that they did not run for dictator, emperor or any of those titles nor did they vote for their leaders back then. I am glad we live in a country where elections are held and we have the right as American citizens to vote for our leaders, but Christians live in another Kingdom and our King is Jesus.
A good scriptural example is the children of Israel. Remember when they wanted a king like the other nations, but God did not want them to have one because He was their King? Remember that one. God warned them that if they wanted to have a king like the rest of the nations, then it would be to their ruin. God finally gave into their request (permissive will, not perfect will), gave them a king, and it was to their ruin.
The only responsibility that we as Christians have towards our leaders is not to vote for them but to submit to them and to pray for them.
God bless
Mark
Mark S. Scaliotti
"Faith is trusting God for all things, in all things, and through all things, no matter what."
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1187 is a reply to message #1174] |
Sat, 09 February 2008 17:14 |
a barn kid
Messages: 14
Registered: November 2006 |
Junior Member |
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Ok, so it is God who puts them in office............
but how will a man like Huckabee, an man who was an evangelical minister, who believes in creation, prolife and against gay marriage BE ELECTED if christians don't go out and vote for him?
The homosexuals aren't going to vote for him.
The prochoicers aren't going to vote for him.
The non-christians aren't going to vote for him.
When we say that God puts them in office, how does God do that, if not by our votes?
How does a conservative Supreme Court judge get appointed but for a conservative President appointing him?
I mean, Hillary Clinton isn't going to appoint someone who is prolife.
We want conservative christians leading our country - would it be a sin to BE or VOTE FOR one moral compass in your county, in your State, in our White House?
Not being involved in the political process was always something I thought was bad growing up........and that it was something we christians just left up to God. But I never really knew what was bad about it........
As an adult, and growing up to see how the process works - I started out thinking that it almost seemed a sin for people to vote for someone who, for example, was a pro choice supporter - helped pass laws that killed the unborn.
Then I started wondering if I almost had some bit of responsibility for that person being in office because I DIDN'T vote. This sort of laizzez faire mindset to leaders in my city, my state, my Country.
I noticed how Bush won the election over Gore by a few hundred votes in Florida.......I started thinking, "What if a few hundred more christians voted in every county? In every State?"
I wondered WHY do we not vote? Why is our voice not heard? WHY ARE WE SILENT?
It seems nonsense to attend anti-abortion non-violent marches once a year - which many christians do........and yet NOT vote. It's a bit late at that point.
:shrug:
I'm just watching the Presidential race and intrigued to see someone SO conservative actually getting somewhere in the race.
I think there are ALOT of people who are conservative who just simply don't vote - - and in that case, some flaming, unregenerate liberal is going to be in charge - and then they will pass laws about no prayer in schools, legalizing gay marriage, greater abortion rights such as no parental consent for minors getting abortions, it not being illegal for an adult to take a minor across state lines to get abortions, funding abortions with federal money, federal money funding stem cell research, etc.
I've come to no clear conclusion on this.......but I am thinking through this whole evangelical "render unto Ceaser" thing and whether it actually only applies to me paying my taxes (which it appear to me to be the case) or whether it means christians are really supposed to be silent on these matters.
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1189 is a reply to message #1187] |
Sat, 09 February 2008 21:54 |
Mark L
Messages: 834
Registered: October 2006
Location: Canada |
Senior Member |
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If Huckabee got in it wouldn't matter anyway. All the other important positions would be filled by people who think differently. The president has virtually no say who fills the 3-400 odd positions that matter. They are all filled from the same group. Im talking here about Council of Foreign Relations / one worlders. If you don't know what I'm talking about here are 2 books to start you off.
http://amazon.ca/s/ref=nb_ss_b?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks &field-keywords=The+Bilderberg+Group&Go.x=10&Go. y=15
And
http://amazon.ca/s/ref=nb_ss_b?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks &field-keywords=None+dare+call+it+conspiracy&Go.x=12 &Go.y=10
The bible speaking of a one world gov. (speaking purely of this world) is well under way and virtually unstoppable. I am speaking of nothing spiritual here. We are going to see a one world gov. in our lifetime whether we like it or not. Assuming it is God's time for it to happen of course.
"When we say that God puts them in office, how does God do that, if not by our votes? "
First of all when we say God does it; that is really putting too narrow a focus on it. There is a vast beaurocracy (sp?) in the spiritual realm that makes all the decisions for this world. Including the US presidency. Those decisions are greatly affected by our prayers. Who goes into the presidency is determined well in advance of the vote. The result is the outworking of that decision. I'm not talking here about predestination. You'll have to forgive me if I'm not expressing this well. I've thought about all this for a long time but have never really verbalised it.
What is really interesting about all this is in the 70's the call went out by the Spirit to the charismatic church to pray for the country. The result was 8 yrs of a Reagan presidency. Which brought a whole lot of good. Too much to mention here. What it also did was galvanise christians who should have known better to get into politics with the result that we now have the reputation we do. I can't say strongly enough if xians had kept on praying instead we would have a country that was prolife etc.
I'm just going to say straight out that xians that are involved in the political process and agitating for change etc.( and lots are deeply involved) are very very foolish and don't have a clue which way is up spiritually. I'm not speaking here of someone who just votes of course.
The bottom line about the presidency is the decision was made in the spiritual realm far in advance of the vote and the actual vote is just the outworking of that.
Fires will be kindled to testify that two and two make four. Swords will be drawn to prove that leaves are green in summer.”
G.K. Chesterton
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1191 is a reply to message #1174] |
Sun, 10 February 2008 14:55 |
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mark1124
Messages: 48
Registered: February 2006
Location: Salem, Mass. |
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To barnkid and others: Romans 13:1 and following says, "Let every soul be subject unto the higher powers. For there is no power but of God: the powers that be are ordained of God. Whosoever therefore resisteth the power, resisteth the ordinance of God: and they that resist shall receive to themselves damnation. For rulers are not a terror to good works, but to the evil. Wilt thou then not be afraid of the power? do that which is good, and thou shalt have praise of the same: For he is the minister of God to thee for good. But if thou do that which is evil, be afraid; for he beareth not the sword in vain: for he is the minister of God, a revenger to execute wrath upon him that doeth evil. Wherefore ye must needs be subject, not only for wrath, but also for conscience sake. For for this cause pay ye tribute also: for they are God's ministers, attending continually upon this very thing.
So yes, I do believe that our leaders are appointed by God, even BEFORE the election. Here is an interesting story, whether you want to believe it or not. If you have ever heard of Perry Stone, he is an excellent teacher from Cleveland TN. At the time that our current president was still governor of TX, Perry met up with him in Israel one time. Perry introduced himself to the then Governor Bush and gave him a word from the Lord. He told Gov. Bush that he was going to be president one day, and that was the time when Gov. Bush wasn't sure if he was going to run or not. I have the video to prove it. And where is the former Gov. Bush now? Still in Texas? Nope. In Washington DC.
And do you think that it was coincidence that there was a problem with the chads in Florida which caused GWB to win in that state? I don't think so.
And what happens if Hilary Clinton gets into the White House? During the time of William Branham's ministry, he received a word from the Lord that someday, a woman was going to be president, and if that happened, it would be the end of the United States. Think what you want of Branham. We shall see if the prophecy comes true or not come November. I hope she doesn't get in personally. But if that is the will of God, so be it.
I remember one well known teacher of the Tulsa faith camp once prophesied that we are going to have a tongue talking president in the White House. Well, so far, we haven't. But if God wills it, praise God.
All I can suggest is that you pray about the matter on whether a Christian should vote or not.
And what about the question as whether a Christian should run for President or any other office? Look what happened to Pat Robertson back in the 80's. He ran for president. Why didn't God put him in the White House? And many Christians voted for him. I remember that one. It looked like God had somebody else in mind. Looks like those Christians went against the will of God. Pardon me for being satiracle here but I am just making a point.
Well, that's all I have to say. I am glad I am not posting this over at the Factnet zoo. I would have the typical naysayers that confronted me there for a few years try to battle me over this issue. But we are not there and thank God we can have a somewhat sane conversation here without the name calling stuff.
All I am saying and asking is that you pray about the matter and let God guide you. OK? Seek His wisdom. Seek His face. And Seek His will.
God Bless.
Mark
[Updated on: Sun, 10 February 2008 14:58]
Mark S. Scaliotti
"Faith is trusting God for all things, in all things, and through all things, no matter what."
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1192 is a reply to message #1191] |
Sun, 10 February 2008 15:34 |
a barn kid
Messages: 14
Registered: November 2006 |
Junior Member |
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Why didn't God put Robertson, a professing Christian, in the White House?
Well, Pat Robertson endorsed Guiliani, right? The pro choice, pro gay marriage, "Republican".
I'm going to go ahead and say I'm not surprised that God didn't put Pat in the White House. Perhaps God couldn't tell that Pat was a christian (as I question how a real christian would support an openly pro abortion rights politician) like I can't tell that Guiliani was a Republican.
[Updated on: Sun, 10 February 2008 15:36]
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1194 is a reply to message #1193] |
Sun, 10 February 2008 17:48 |
Mark L
Messages: 834
Registered: October 2006
Location: Canada |
Senior Member |
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I'm not surprised he didn't put him in the White House either. He has done a lot of right things mostly many yrs ago. Politics corrupts people. That's why Chesterton didn't want to see women in politics. Because it is a dirty corupting business. For whatever reason politics and business seems to have had its toll on Pat Robertson.
I would also like to say with no criticism intended whatsoever that I can always tell xians who don't pray for their gov. Because they are partisan in their politics. Praying especially in tongues has the effect of lifting one out of our
secular view of things. You begin to see things as God sees them. You lose the kneejerk reactions to issues.
There is lots to say on this entire subject of politics. Lots to say on what is going on in our Govs in the western world. What we read in the secular media has very little relation to reality. Mainly because the powers behind the thrones (presidency) are the same powers that control the media.
Very interesting subject.
Fires will be kindled to testify that two and two make four. Swords will be drawn to prove that leaves are green in summer.”
G.K. Chesterton
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1196 is a reply to message #1195] |
Mon, 11 February 2008 11:10 |
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mark1124
Messages: 48
Registered: February 2006
Location: Salem, Mass. |
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Well now you are comparing apples with oranges. Of course we should brush our teeth, just like when we have problems with our cars, we need to take them to a mechanic to fix.
Like hardbones said, this is an interesting topic. But all I am going to say is what I shared with you from the scriptures already. I think it may be a good idea to search out church history and see how the early Christians viewed politics.
I have some other thoughts to write on this topic, but will do so later after I do a little research to confirm them.
One thought first, look at the campaigns from this year and years gone by. How many times have you seen candidates rail on other candidates? How many politicians do you see boasting on themselves and not the other candidate? Right off the top, they are violating scriptures right there, just to win votes to get themselves into office. I do see a lot of contradictions from scripture in the way politicians campaign for public office.
Mark
Mark S. Scaliotti
"Faith is trusting God for all things, in all things, and through all things, no matter what."
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1200 is a reply to message #1197] |
Tue, 12 February 2008 03:05 |
Mark L
Messages: 834
Registered: October 2006
Location: Canada |
Senior Member |
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I don't see anything particualy wrong with voting. My point is and Freemans too is that it is a waste of time because the outcome has already been determined. Read the book of Daniel. All the major kingdoms that would affect Israel were prophsied in detail in advance. Right to the end of the world.
They win elections by the votes cast but the votes are cast according to a predetermined outcome.
Now prayer can determine an outcome. But even that may not fit our preconceived ideas or hopes. Martin Luther said he would prefer (in gov.) a wise turk (heathen) rather than a foolish xian. Because he wanted good gov. Prayer can bring good gov. Regardless of their positons. In the final anyalsis it doesn't matter who is in power because they are all under the control of the devil. Under God and with Gods purposes in mind as well. Paul said pray so we get good gov and can live quietly and in peace.
As I said before from a purely practical point of view electing Huckabee (who would be my choice) wouldn't amount to a hill of beans. Because he can't do anything anyway. A long time ago Jimmy Carter became president. Now I don't think much of him but he is a bro in the Lord. The night he was elected Pat Robertson and someone else went to his Hotel room with a list of xian men who would be good candidates to fill some of the cabinet and advisory positions. JC took the list and got quite emotional because he couldn't do anything about it. Nobody consults the pres. unless they want him to stand up in public and say something. Maybe thats going a little too far but not much.
Fires will be kindled to testify that two and two make four. Swords will be drawn to prove that leaves are green in summer.”
G.K. Chesterton
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1201 is a reply to message #1200] |
Tue, 12 February 2008 03:24 |
-Bill
Messages: 15
Registered: February 2008 |
Junior Member |
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If God puts all the leaders in office, then wouldn't it be a sin to vote against the winner? Voting does not determine rulers, God does. If God wants an evil ruler for judgment, would you still vote against him/her? God sets evil rulers in place. Who are we to resist Him? Notice the phrase "I will send him".
Isaiah 10
5 O Assyrian, the rod of mine anger, and the staff in their hand is mine indignation.
6 I will send him against an hypocritical nation, and against the people of my wrath will I give him a charge, to take the spoil, and to take the prey, and to tread them down like the mire of the streets.
7 Howbeit he meaneth not so, neither doth his heart think so; but it is in his heart to destroy and cut off nations not a few.
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1215 is a reply to message #1213] |
Wed, 13 February 2008 17:53 |
Duncan
Messages: 95
Registered: February 2006 |
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Derick,
I understand that once the period of the Caesar's began, the democracy ended. My point was not to say that Paul was voting. Rather, it was to say that Paul used the fact that he and Silas were Roman citizens to their advantage.
I know that I am just a "pilgrim passing through," and my citizenship is heavenly. However, just like Paul and Rome, I am also a citizen of the United States. Back to Barn Kid's thoughts - why would we not use our citizenship of the US to our benefit? I'm not talking about running for office but rather being involved in moral issues.
Several folks on this thread have made their argument that God has already determined the outcome of elections (in which I totally agree), so we would be voting against God's choice if our candidate lost. Let me take that same logic and apply it to sharing the gospel. If God has alread determined who will and who will not be saved (which I totally believe), why should we share the gospel with someone. If a person is predetermined to be lost, then we would be trying to get them to do something that is against God's predetermined will.
Please don't think I am being argumentative, I'm just throwing out some comments to get us all to think through our positions before we tow the FA line of doctrine.
Have a great day!
Duncan
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1218 is a reply to message #1215] |
Thu, 14 February 2008 14:20 |
Derick N.
Messages: 75
Registered: November 2007 |
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| Duncan wrote on Wed, 13 February 2008 11:53 |
Derick,
I understand that once the period of the Caesar's began, the democracy ended. My point was not to say that Paul was voting. Rather, it was to say that Paul used the fact that he and Silas were Roman citizens to their advantage.
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Sure. But Paul had a visitation from God telling him that he would be preaching in Rome, so his citizenship was merely a ticket to get him to Caesar. He sure didn't go to Rome to influence the political process.
| Duncan wrote on Wed, 13 February 2008 11:53 |
I know that I am just a "pilgrim passing through," and my citizenship is heavenly. However, just like Paul and Rome, I am also a citizen of the United States. Back to Barn Kid's thoughts - why would we not use our citizenship of the US to our benefit? I'm not talking about running for office but rather being involved in moral issues.
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I don't know about you Duncan, but I have my hands full with my own moral issues and the few that God has entrusted me with. If you have the power to influence many and the anointing to do it, go for it. But remember this:
"Unless the Lord build the house, they labor in vain that build."
| Duncan wrote on Wed, 13 February 2008 11:53 |
Several folks on this thread have made their argument that God has already determined the outcome of elections (in which I totally agree), so we would be voting against God's choice if our candidate lost. Let me take that same logic and apply it to sharing the gospel. If God has already determined who will and who will not be saved (which I totally believe), why should we share the gospel with someone. If a person is predetermined to be lost, then we would be trying to get them to do something that is against God's predetermined will.
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Apples and oranges Brother. You cannot truthfully compare sharing the gospel of our Risen Lord with campaigning for your favored candidate now can you?
If God has clearly anointed a particular candidate above all others, would not all of his people be aware of it? But we are not aware, and it is the same as it was in the days of the Judges when every man did what was right in his own eyes.
| Duncan wrote on Wed, 13 February 2008 11:53 |
Please don't think I am being argumentative, I'm just throwing out some comments to get us all to think through our positions before we tow the FA line of doctrine.
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99.9% of the time, the "FA line of doctrine" is pure bible. I never did trust it blindly, but have never been able to clearly disprove anything I was taught. It reminds me of a football penalty call where the coach throws in the red flag in order to challenge the penalty. Unless there is clear evidence to the contrary, the penalty is enforced.
I am in my early 50's and have never voted once in my life. My vote would have changed nothing, and I would not have wanted it to. Everything in the world is exactly how God wants it. If He wanted it some other way, it would be.
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1333 is a reply to message #1174] |
Mon, 25 February 2008 06:14 |
tomax7
Messages: 44
Registered: August 2006
Location: Calgary, AB |
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...you know, I have been struggling with this also and in a bit disagree with Br. Freeman, voting isn't a waste of time, it is fulfilling God's law of sowing and reaping.
Yes, we are 'not to be entangled with the affairs of this world' but does that mean we don't exist or never phone a politician to complain about a law or a by-law officer when the neighbours dog is barking?
At one extreme we have those who don't stand for national anthems, and at the other extreme we have those saying God told them who to vote for.
Whether or not Paul used his citizenship to preach in Rome - the fact is he still had and used it.
In Australia I believe they are governed by law to vote. Now what? Well go vote silly.
Unfortunately we threw the baby out with the bathwater regarding some issues, and exercising the benefits of US/Canadian citizenship is one of them I believe.
Maybe go live in a Communist/Dictatorship type of country and see how free and spiritual you become because you don't have to vote.
Or the 'don't go vote because it has already been determined' by God thinking.
Umm, no. Sure God ordains authority, but He doesn't things in a vacuum.
I see the same fatalistic thinking that screwed up a lot of minds back in FA.
Look, God doesn't work with parked cars, how the heck do you think God gets the leader in? Of course we can argue predestination and about dictators and such, but let's stick with us here.
Votes don't just mysteriously show up in ballot boxes as a norm.
Crap, that's almost on par of a miracle as the loaves and fishes. Who says miracles don't happen? Or does God have secret agent angels in disguise voting across the country?
Hello?
Heck, let's look at it the other way.
If all the Christians stayed home during voting because it is predestined, we'd probably usher in the Anti-Christ faster than God planned (so to speak).
Here's a good old saying:
"All that is required for evil to prevail is for good men to do nothing" - by Edmund Burke.
Heck get out and vote, but don't get all spiritual about it. Read up on the candidate, do your homework.
I see people saying "God just called us to pray" a lot of times as a cop out of doing their responsibility as a citizen.
On the other hand don't blame God if your candidate looses and if you start hearing voices who to vote for - get delivered.
Voting works on God's law of averages. You know, like casing lots. He puts the people where He wants, so do you want to be a part of that or just sit back and pretend to be super-spiritual...
If more American's want to sin, then they'd vote a sinner in. We are suppose to be the salt, a hedge, a light in the darkness.
Kinda hard being a light while sitting home during elections.
God won't break His laws of sowing and reaping.
Remember how we used to 'believe' God would send money or cars to us supernaturally? God doesn't on a norm make things appear out of thin air.
That money your believing for, does it have a serial number? God isn't into counterfeiting, heck it's Caesar's to begin with, so He had to move on someone who already has it to give it to you.
God has to move on people must mean He uses people to fulfill His will or answer prayers. Do the math.
--------------------------------------------
Of course don't get entangled with the affairs of the world - back to politics.
So if we take the absolute of not being 'entangled' is true, then can we say that any or all Christians involved in politics today is clearly sinning? Of course not.
Remember who was the first 'heathen' to get saved? A Roman centurion. You know, a military, Rome, type guy involved indirectly with politics.
So, my approach to voting is like wine, partake in it if you want to, but just don't get drunk with it ok? Because that would fulfil the legalistic 'partaking' part.
cheers
Tom
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Remember to Smile! God loves you!
www.tomax7.com
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1350 is a reply to message #1340] |
Tue, 26 February 2008 00:41 |
tomax7
Messages: 44
Registered: August 2006
Location: Calgary, AB |
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Hey, no problem, you are entitled to your own opinion Derick.
But you extrue the same legalistic thinking that ruined a lot of lives back in the 80's by demeaning someone who doesn't agree with your views.
You didn't happen chance to think that maybe God allows man's flaws and Satan's tactics to delay His plans?
Something about free choice. How that for a short verbose?
**********************************
Remember to Smile! God loves you!
www.tomax7.com
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #1351 is a reply to message #1350] |
Tue, 26 February 2008 01:31 |
Derick N.
Messages: 75
Registered: November 2007 |
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| tomax7 wrote on Mon, 25 February 2008 18:41 |
Hey, no problem, you are entitled to your own opinion Derick.
But you extrue the same legalistic thinking that ruined a lot of lives back in the 80's by demeaning someone who doesn't agree with your views.
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One man's legalism is another man's freedom. Anyway I know who you are, and I'm not demeaning you at all, just disagreeing.
| tomax7 wrote on Mon, 25 February 2008 18:41 |
You didn't happen chance to think that maybe God allows man's flaws and Satan's tactics to delay His plans?
Something about free choice. How that for a short verbose?
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Brother, if God "allows" man's flaws and satan's tactics, then that proves my point that these things were all contained in his original plan. He already knew about them and compensated for them.
If every believer miraculously got on the same page and voted a "christian politician" (an oxymoron if there ever was one) into the White House, what purpose would it serve? Do you think the country would magically head towards the path of righteousness? I don't think so. More than likely there would be a backlash of evil that would take us further into darkness than we are now. There never has been nor ever will be a moral majority.
I feel bad for you that you think that Faith Assembly caused so many "screwed up minds", as my mind and the minds of most people I knew from those days were about as "unscrewed" as a human can get. You want to talk screwed up? Yu should have met me before I came to FA and Christ.
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #3106 is a reply to message #1174] |
Thu, 04 September 2008 00:56 |
james
Messages: 2137
Registered: April 2008
Location: Birmingham, AL |
Senior Member |
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Humm... Indeed, which one?
Well, come November we'll know who God wants in office. I noticed when this thread started back in Feb. not many folks voiced their convictions. I agree with what Bro. Freeman taught on this,even though it requires defending to many fellow christians(as does most stands we take that mainstream christianity doesn't agree with).
IMO: Neither candidate exactly exemplifies christian leadership. But I'd better not get started...
May God's will be done, on earth as it is in heaven...
[Updated on: Thu, 04 June 2009 16:02]
“But God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us,”
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #4141 is a reply to message #4139] |
Tue, 11 November 2008 18:27 |
james
Messages: 2137
Registered: April 2008
Location: Birmingham, AL |
Senior Member |
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Thanks Mark,
That was a good point the man made, and very true. Hopefully more christians will learn that by obeying Jesus,( like the man said, DOING the things Jesus told us to do) and praying for His will being done and resting in Him, we will see changes.And his point about the changes taking place in hearts resulting in the moral standards being raised, is also true. I just don't see it happening...
btw: did you notice how the name of God was changed in the article to G-d, what's that all about?
“But God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us,”
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| Re: Will you vote for the next President? Do you follow primaries? Is it a lack of faith to vote? [message #4142 is a reply to message #4141] |
Tue, 11 November 2008 23:29 |
Mark L
Messages: 834
Registered: October 2006
Location: Canada |
Senior Member |
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Jewish people don't like to pronounce or mention God's name. It's sacred or holy I guess. When they read the bible and see God's personal name ( Yahveh) They automatically substitute Adonai for it. Its called Kethiv (written) and Qere (to be read)meaning - here is what is written but here is what to read. It is very common in Jewish literature & even newspapers. Some xians do it too.
Fires will be kindled to testify that two and two make four. Swords will be drawn to prove that leaves are green in summer.”
G.K. Chesterton
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