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Serious? [message #13656]

Fri, 01 January 2021 01:27

Mark L
Messages: 858
Registered: October 2006
Location: Canada

Senior Member

I'm not sure. I keep hearing about people like this but always wonder if its a real belief. I saw it as someones tagline on christianforums.com.

I usually have a look over there once a day but don't usually comment. Once you comment or post you have to keep responding and there goes the night. Smile

Its enough for me to post here.

There are quite a number of intelligent knowledgeable people there and a lot of interesting topics. Calvinism vs Arminianism for eg. Or what does Revelation mean. But as I say once you start you have to keep up. Then there goes the night.

There is of course a lot of people there that need straightening out (and I'm just the man to do it). I think I posted this before
but in the interest of keeping everyone here informed of my new job . . .

https://imgs.xkcd.com/comics/duty_calls.png

Anyway my point was someone posted this as their tagline and I don't know if they are serious or not. But at the very least its interesting.

Gods created Creation
Heaven and Earth is Flat and Stationary
Nowhere in the Bible is it stated that God created a universe/outer space. Where the sun, moon, stars, are located thousand and millions of miles away. Nowhere in the Bible is it stated that God created planets. Only heaven, earth, the sun, moon and stars (host of heaven) is stated as being Gods creation. The sun, moon and stars are located above the stationary earth in the raqia (dome) between two bodies of water that the raqia (dome) separated and is still separating, the oceans and a body of water above the raqia (dome).

[Updated on: Fri, 01 January 2021 01:30]

You can read
"Meanderings on Scripture by Mark
https://mlederman.substack.com/

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Re: Serious? [message #13657 is a reply to message #13656]

Fri, 01 January 2021 02:19

william
Messages: 1466
Registered: January 2006

Senior Member
Administrator

I'm probably not the one to talk here because I've been running into a lot of people with strange beliefs... so much so that I'm beginning to second guess myself!

Anyway, I think that the tagline does illustrate something that should interest us all and that is the concept of 'belief' or 'faith', if you will. Most of us aren't scientists. Most aren't involved in high level theoretical calculus or mathematics.

That said, unless we "believe" those who are involved in those disciplines we are limited to those things that we can observe or test for ourselves. Again, in most cases the best we could do would be to conclude that the earth is flat based on our limited understanding and limited ability to test our "theories". I don't think (I could be wrong) that the average human being could conclusively prove that the earth was anything other than flat.

We need a higher authority than ourselves to tell us that the earth is round. We do this all the time when we choose to believe God about some promise or some concept that the Bible presents to us.

This brings us to an interesting dilemma: We have that authority in God but "science" is another matter... sometimes the science is good but the track record for science hasn't been all that stellar in the past!

Given that fact, is it any wonder some people doubt those pronouncements that we all have heard since grade-school? After all, "science" has given us so many wonderful pronouncements: like evolution! Etc..

Of course, if we could find our authority in something that we could trust absolutely, the Bible, for instance, then we'd be on solid ground!

[Isa 40:22 KJV] 22 [It is] he that sitteth upon the circle of the earth, and the inhabitants thereof [are] as grasshoppers; that stretcheth out the heavens as a curtain, and spreadeth them out as a tent to dwell in:

Even with this passage (and somewhere I've heard that there are others) there are reasonable explanations that insist that the word "circle" above doesn't mean "round" but perhaps a "circuit". If this is true we are back in the same place we started--having to trust or believe those more qualified than ourselves.

Hope this doesn't take you more than a day to digest!!!!

Blessings,
William

[Updated on: Sat, 02 January 2021 02:40]

I want to believe!

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Re: Serious? [message #13658 is a reply to message #13657]

Sat, 02 January 2021 02:06

Mark L
Messages: 858
Registered: October 2006
Location: Canada

Senior Member

I took another look at 1 Tim. 5/20 "oppositions of science falsely so-called".

It doesn't actually say science is false. It says when science is opposing truth. Science is just looking at and understanding in a coherent way what God has created. It is very interesting to me that modern science (science based on the last few hundred yrs) is built directly on a Judeo/Christian worldview. Meaning that God had created the world in an orderly way one thing built on another and it could be understood that way. Much of the world didn't and still doesn't believe that. A lot and maybe most of the early modern scientists were devout Christians who believed that. This is why modern science developed.

An example of science is electricity. Its reality of it, the wires that carry it, the switch that turns it on is all developed by science. Obviously not science falsely so-called.

So it is when science is used against the truth that it is false.

Paul also says to Tim to avoid the whole issue. Vs 21 says that "some professing have erred concerning the faith". That is a remarkable statement. My reading of that is that some are/were accepting or arguing in favor of science that opposed the gospel/truth. There are large numbers of Christians today doing exactly that. Arguing in favor of evolution for eg. Or theistic evolution. Or God and . . .

I find the whole subject of science interesting especially in light of all the discoveries going on. So I don't think we are not supposed to take any interest. I think Paul is saying 2 things

1. Avoid arguing over false science. Just stay with the word.
2. Some are going to believe false science anyway. Avoid the argument.

So is the earth flat? I'll just stick with "circle of the earth and avoid debating it. Smile

You can read
"Meanderings on Scripture by Mark
https://mlederman.substack.com/

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Re: Serious? [message #13659 is a reply to message #13658]

Sat, 02 January 2021 02:38

william
Messages: 1466
Registered: January 2006

Senior Member
Administrator

Ha! You smoothed over that pretty quickly! I was surprised that this thread lay dormant for 24 hours... I figured that someone, somewhere, would jump on this with zeal!

Concerning science, yes, I agree with what you said; I'm definitely not one of those knee-jerk-anti-science fanatics.

That said, I refuse to give "science" top billing over the bible.

I don't think that believing, or not believing, in a flat-earth, or for that matter, a round earth, is something that believers must hash out like it's some sort of article of faith!

Blessings,
William

I want to believe!

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Re: Serious? [message #13660 is a reply to message #13659]

Sat, 02 January 2021 17:11

james
Messages: 2142
Registered: April 2008
Location: Birmingham, AL

Senior Member

Just replying to let you guys know I'm still here.

I have a suggestion for anyone who wants a good way to observe that the earth is round, go to the ocean, get in a boat, and head out away from land. After a mile or so look back and look at the hotels (or trees, mountains, ect), you will see that they have disappeared. If the world was flat, they'd still be there, just smaller.

Free wisdom (or common sense)...anything more and I'd have to charge for it. lol

Hope you guys have a blessed 2021.

“But God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us,”

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Re: Serious? [message #13661 is a reply to message #13660]

Sat, 02 January 2021 23:46

william
Messages: 1466
Registered: January 2006

Senior Member
Administrator

Quote:

I have a suggestion for anyone who wants a good way to observe that the earth is round, go to the ocean, get in a boat, and head out away from land. After a mile or so look back and look at the hotels (or trees, mountains, ect), you will see that they have disappeared. If the world was flat, they'd still be there, just smaller.

The more alcohol involved the quicker the phenomena will be observed!

Obviously you've swallowed hook line and sinker the old story about Columbus sitting on the shore and watching the boats coming in and going out. tsk, tsk, tsk.

Do the above and take a telescope... I'm told (again with those higher authorities!) that the telescope will bring everything (from top to bottom) back into focus.

Blessings,
William

I want to believe!

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Re: Serious? [message #13662 is a reply to message #13661]

Sun, 03 January 2021 00:00

james
Messages: 2142
Registered: April 2008
Location: Birmingham, AL

Senior Member

I can't tell when you're kidding sometimes, it only takes about half a pint of Crown Royal to do the trick. Mark should be impressed that I knew a quality Canadian whiskey.
No, really I've been on the ocean (Gulf of Mexico) numerous times and observed this.
See! Now nobody's getting fat except momma Cass.
Five bonus points if anyone recognizes the above statement without the aid of Google.

[Updated on: Sun, 03 January 2021 00:02]

“But God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us,”

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Re: Serious? [message #13663 is a reply to message #13662]

Sun, 03 January 2021 00:12

william
Messages: 1466
Registered: January 2006

Senior Member
Administrator

Well, I lose the bonus points...ugh!

I'm going to ask you one question and if the answer is yes then you are going to become my go-to-authority for these matters... especially since those executives at youtube seem to have removed all of my flat-earth evidence!

Did you, or did you not, view said phenomena with a telescope!

Blessings,
William

I want to believe!

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Re: Serious? [message #13664 is a reply to message #13662]

Sun, 03 January 2021 00:54

Mark L
Messages: 858
Registered: October 2006
Location: Canada

Senior Member

james wrote on Sun, 03 January 2021 00:00

See! Now nobody's getting fat except momma Cass.
Five bonus points if anyone recognizes the above statement without the aid of Google.

You can tell none of us are millennials or Gen X or Z. Smile

You can read
"Meanderings on Scripture by Mark
https://mlederman.substack.com/

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Re: Serious? [message #13665 is a reply to message #13664]

Sun, 03 January 2021 01:05

james
Messages: 2142
Registered: April 2008
Location: Birmingham, AL

Senior Member

Dude! I'm older than you, Gary, or Mark...😂

It's from The Mamas and Papas 1967 "Creeque Ally"

“But God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us,”

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Re: Serious? [message #13666 is a reply to message #13663]

Sun, 03 January 2021 01:09

james
Messages: 2142
Registered: April 2008
Location: Birmingham, AL

Senior Member

Well scientists say that's really what the eye is, a periscope, err I mean a telescope. The captain forbade bringing any foreign objects on board. He said he didn't need NO telescope, he had GPS.

“But God commendeth His love toward us, in that, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us,”

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Re: Serious? [message #13667 is a reply to message #13665]

Sun, 03 January 2021 01:42

william
Messages: 1466
Registered: January 2006

Senior Member
Administrator

james wrote on Sun, 03 January 2021 01:05

Dude! I'm older than you, Gary, or Mark...😂

It's from The Mamas and Papas 1967 "Creeque Ally"

Next you'll be quizzing us about Tennessee Ernie Ford's songs in the fifties... go ahead, tell us grandpa... tell us about the good old days!

Blessings,
William

I want to believe!

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