| Forum: Bible Issues |
|---|
| Topic: The Rapture |
|---|
| The Rapture [message #14157] |
Thu, 29 August 2024 02:15 |
 Mark L
Messages: 849
Registered: October 2006
Location: Canada |
Senior Member |
|
|
I posted to my Substack (link below) I thought I would post it here as well.
The Rapture
My position
1. There will be a rapture and I believe it is on the horizon.
2. It will occur at or shortly before the beginning of the tribulation
3. I'm not going to deal with a lot of the issues about a rapture. My point here is simply to show that there are events that have to take place prior to the rapture occurring. So the widespread expectation that it is shortly to happen is simply wrong. I should add here that I hope I am wrong. I'd be happy to go.
4. I have some thoughts about the nature and timing of the rapture but its beyond the scope of this note.
5. I'm not going to bog the note down with a lot of scripture. I will post a list at the bottom.
Jesus said no one knows the day or hour but . . .
Paul said we will see the day coming and . . .
Jesus said in Mark 13 we are to watch
I want to be absolutely clear that I along with much of Christendom see the day coming.
I have 2 good reasons why the rapture is not at hand and both can be found in
2 Thess. 2/3-4
Let no man deceive you by any means for that day shall not come except there come a falling away first and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition
The falling away
If the falling away is an end time sign then it has to be something significant. Yes it is happening in the world but is it so significant as to be an end time sign? I think the falling away is the result of :
1. Persecution which Jesus said in Luke 21/12 would be the first thing to happen
This will begin with an unreasoning resentment toward Christians and end (at the rapture) with an implacable hatred.
2. Many being deceived (and falling away) because of false Christs and false prophets (teachers/ministers/apostles)
3. Following great leaders who are themselves deceived.
4. Because they are culturally christian and so just follow the world.
5. I think by the beginning of the tribulation there will nothing christian (culturally or spiritually) anywhere in the world outside the true church. By the time of the rapture only those with Jesus deeply embedded in their hearts will be left standing
So a question . . . Why would all this happen in the tribulation if the church isn't there?
Why the persecution if its only in the trib. Who is getting persecuted?
Here is another question . . .. If the end time signs Jesus talked about and are seen to some degree around the world now are the evidence the rapture is near then why aren't these signs happening to any real seriousness in the western world. Are we here in the safe secure western world going to escaped it all and just go up in the rapture?
The persecution will be so God can cleanse his church. Before he deals with the world in the tribulation he has to deal with his own house. God is going to cleanse his church of sin & worldliness and set things in their proper order. I think the the rapture of the church is the fulfillment of Eph. 5/27.
The rise of Antichrist.
The other end time sign in 2 Thess. 2/3-4. I'm not going into a lot of detail here. But just to make the point. The trib. starts with the signing of a peace treaty between Israel and the Antichrist. How can that happen if he is not already on the scene. I think he will seize power in western Europe in the confusion following the war of Gog and Magog.
Another reason why the rapture is not immediately at hand and admittedly this is my opinion. I believe what Jesus spoke of in Matt 24, Luke 21 and Mark 13 "all these are the beginning of sorrows" happen prior to the trib and the rapture. The persecution has to happen prior to all that though.
We have in the bible two examples of men who were raptured. Elijah and Enoch. I believe they are there as examples for us to strive for. Enoch pleased God. Paul said he was translated by faith. James said Elijah could pray a prayer of faith that stopped rain on the earth. I don't think we all need to be Enochs or Elijahs but if we aren't walking a consecrated life like Enoch and in faith like Elijah then how are we going to get raptured? Do we or I personally fulfill Eph. 5/27?
Do I believe it is coming. Yes I do. I just think Eph. 5/27 is a necessary precursor.
Lastly for me personally I am going to get raptured the same way Elijah did! With the chariot and horseman of Israel. Its only going to happen once (for me) and I want to enjoy the experience. It may be the twinkling of an eye but that twinkling is going to be long enough for me to savour and enjoy it.
1 Cor 15/51-52 we shall not all sleep
Eph. 5/27 without spot or wrinkle
Luke 21 Matt 24 Mark 13 who is going to be deceived? Whats the point of deceiving the heathen?
1 Thess 4/13 5/11
Matt. 24/36 day or the hour
1 Thess 5/4 see the day coming
Mark 13/35-37 watch
2 Thess 2/1-12
Luke 21/12 The first thing to happen will be a persecution of Christians.
Enoch Gen 5/21-24 Heb 11/5-6
Elijah James 5/17-18 2 Kings 2/11
You can read "Meanderings on Scripture by Mark
https://mlederman.substack.com/
|
|
|
| Forum: Introductions & General |
|---|
| Topic: Revelations ch.6 |
|---|
| Re: Revelations ch.6 [message #14158 is a reply to message #14152] |
Thu, 29 August 2024 19:32 |
openairpreacher
Messages: 13
Registered: August 2023 |
Junior Member |
|
|
the bible dose not teach Christian's to look into the Zodiac. as a way that God communicates....you used that word and told me on the phone God made the zodiac as to justify using that word..i remember when i was young Dr Freeman warned about this.( angels of light ) .i notice you say not " astrology" and here you're bringing up looking into the stars for the future. I was not going to say anything about this but I feel compelled to bring it up. this is for protection against the possibility of what seems to be occult. when you used the word zodiac it's tied to the occult. the Bible warns about soothsayers or stargazers..
and i disassociated
|
|
|
Members
Search
Help
Register
Login
Home
